Ask about Judaism

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zeek
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by zeek »

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Last edited by zeek on Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

It could have been, doesn't have to have been.

Whether one thinks it was the Passover meal or not depends on which gospel chronology you go with, because they are different. In one, the dinner is the Passover meal and the next day was the first day of Passover, except if that were the case, it is somewhat unlikely that the Romans would have been executing anyone, plus there's that bit about pleading to get him down 'before the Sabbath' at sundown. (just because it says' the sabbath' doesn't absolutely mean the day was on Friday, because it is possible to use 'the sabbath' to refer to the first day of Passover also - do I need to explain that Jewish 'days' begin at sundown here?)

John, I think, puts the dinner on the day BEFORE Passover because in John it is very important for Jesus to be equated to the sacrifice of the Passover lamb, which happens on the day (during the day) BEFORE Passover begins (at sundown) so he can do this theological deal with Jesus' death and the death of the Passover lambs going on at the temple at the same time.....get it?

Otherwise, having the dinner be the Passover meal works fine, complete with breaking bread as a group and eating a Passover roasted whole lamb as a group (because it must all be eaten at the one meal, and no single person can do that so you have to have a group) and also the wine. Except if it WAS a Passover meal, then John's whole theory of Jesus being the 'lamb that was slain' etc falls apart.

So pick your side of that argument. I have no ax to grind about it. It can be a Passover dinner or not.

However, the 'seder meal' we have today is probably something actually developed AFTER the destruction of the temple in 70 CE by the Romans, so whatever they were doing it wasn't 'the seder' as we know it now. The seder as we know it now began developing sometime in the late first to third centuries. It was pretty set, most likely, by the middle second century CE.
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DoOrDoNot
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by DoOrDoNot »

In reading this thread, a few of your comments struck me as hinting at nondualism. How does that fit in your understanding if Judaism, if at all, Agricola?

I've been contemplating nondualism through my study of Buddhism, so my ears perked up when I thought I heard hints of it.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

First you'll have to tell me what you mean by 'nondualism'.

Do you mean this?:
a doctrine of classic Brahmanism holding that the essential unity of all is real whereas duality and plurality are phenomenal illusion and that matter is materialized energy which in turn is the temporal manifestation of an incorporeal spiritual eternal essence constituting the innermost self of all things
In which case, not really, but I can see where you could see some similarities.

However by this definition, I THINK the Brahman would say that the material world has no 'reality', and no that wouldn't work. Judaism is bigger on differentiation rather than 'all is one'. You can find some threads of that sort of idea, however, if you delve into the mystical tradition (kabbalah). But as far as I can tell, all mystical traditions head in the 'all is one' direction eventually.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

I think - on a VERY brief search - that 'non-dualism' somewhat equates pantheism - would that be fair? If we make analogies here - Judaism is closer to panENtheism than to pantheism. The world is not God, but the world may be IN God, or God is or can be brought into the world of 'things'. Kabbalistically speaking - and here I am far more familiar with Lurianic kabbalah than merkavah or other earlier mysticisms - the world of creation (all created things including the universe) are not God. At the same time, all things created exist only because they are sustained through God.

Most Jews are not mystics, but the received traditions (mysticism) especially Lurianic ideas, have been pretty influential, and have successfully moved some concepts into 'mainstream' Jewish thought.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

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OK - brief - VERY brief - intro to Lurianic kabbalah.

Maybe I should start with 'kabbalah'. It isn't Madonna.

'Kabbalah' means - basically - the received (tradition). It is (or was until quite recently) taught almost exclusively by oral means (teacher to student). There is a strong attitude saying that you can't properly learn from books, AND - this is important - MOST BOOKS ON KABBALISTIC IDEAS ARE DELIBERATELY WRITTEN TO OBSCURE/HIDE THE MEANING.

So you can read all you like, and you won't learn it, because the written stuff MUST be interpreted by a teacher who will TELL the student that X means Y, and when the book says White you should understand, maybe, Vegetables. Or Ocean. Something totally different.

So -
anyway - Isaac Luria lived in the 16th century. He died early - about age 33. He left a body of oral teachings which were written down by his disciples. (seriously, there are a lot of Jesus parallels here)

Kabbalah as a tradition of mysticism long pre-existed Luria, and continues today, but his ideas were simply SO influential that everything since Luria has had to deal with what Rabbi Isaac Luria said.

Luria is also known as the Ha- Ari, or The Lion. Also as Ha-Ari Ha-Kodesh (the Holy Lion) and also as Arizal (Lion of Blessed Memory).

Sefer HaKavanot U'Ma'aseh Nissim (the book of focus/intention and works of miracles - my translation) records that one day Luria's father remained in the beth kneset (synagogue) alone, studying, when Eliyahu HaNavi (Elijah the Prophet) appeared to him and said, "I have been sent to you by the Almighty to bring you tidings that your holy wife shall conceive and bear a child, and that you must call him Yitzchak (Isaac). He shall begin to deliver Israel from the Klipot [husks, forces of evil]. Through him, numerous souls will receive their tikkun (completion, repair). He is also destined to reveal many hidden mysteries in the Torah and to expound on the Zohar (an extremely influential text of the kabbalah). His fame will spread throughout the world. Take care therefore that you not circumcise him before I come to be the Sandak [who holds the child during the Brit Milah ceremony]."
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

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At the age of fifteen, he married a cousin (me: cousin-marriage is very common in medieval Judaism - keeps things close you know) and, being amply provided for financially, he was able to continue his studies. Though he initially may have pursued a career in business, he soon turned to asceticism and mysticism. Around the age of twenty-two he became engrossed in the study of the Zohar (a major work of the Kabbalah that had recently been printed for the first time) and adopted the life of a recluse. Retreating to the banks of the Nile for seven years, he secluded himself in an isolated cottage, giving himself up entirely to meditation. He visited his family only on Shabbat. But even at home, he would not utter a word, even to his wife. When it was absolutely necessary for him to say something, he would say it in the fewest number of words possible,[3] and then, only in Hebrew. Hassidism (mystically minded 'ultra' orthodox followers of a pietistic movement which began in 18th century Poland) believes that he had frequent interviews with the prophet Elijah through this ascetic life, and was initiated into sublime doctrines by him.
OK here he is - birth predicted by miraculous communication from messenger from heaven. Born in Jerusalem but traveled to Egypt...
Then he returned to the Land of Israel, stayed briefly in Jerusalem and then moved north to Galilee and settled in Safed (pronounced 'Zfat'). I've been there. It's neat - the highest town (elevation) in Israel. Now it is a major mystical religious center as well as a major center for the arts.
he settled in Safed. Safed, over the previous several decades, had become something of a lightning-rod for kabbalistic studies. "[S]pawning an astounding array of impressive religious personalities [including] ... Rabbi Moses Cordovero, Rabbi Shlomo Alkabetz, Rabbi Jacob Berab, Rabbi Moses di Trani, Rabbi Joseph Caro, Rabbi Hayyim Vital, Joseph ibn Tabul, Rabbi Abraham ben Eliezer ha-Levi Berukhim, Rabbi Israel Najara, Rabbi Eleazar Azikri, Rabbi Eliyahu de Vidas, and Rabbi Moses Alshech;"[7] including some lesser known figures such as Rabbi Joseph Hagiz, Rabbi Elisha Galadoa, and Rabbi Moses Bassola
You probably never heard of any of these guys, but trust me, they are famous rabbis and mystics. Joseph Caro and Moses Cordovero especially. Caro literally wrote the book on how to observe ALL the commandments. I even have a copy of it (see Shulkhan Arukh).
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

teaching:
Luria used to deliver his lectures extemporaneously and did not write much, with a few exceptions, including some kabbalistic poems in Aramaic for the Shabbat table. The real exponent of his kabbalistic system was Rabbi Hayyim Vital. He collected all the notes of the lectures which Luria's disciples had made; and from these notes were produced numerous works, the most important of which was the Etz Chayim, ("Tree of Life"), in eight volumes
Here's the short (really REALLY short) summary:
Lurianic Kabbalah describes new supra-rational doctrines of the origins of Creation, and its cosmic rectification, incorporating a recasting and fuller systemisation of preceding Kabbalistic teaching
Under the influence of the mystical renaissance in 16th-century Safed, Lurianism became the near-universal mainstream Jewish theology in the early-modern era, both in scholarly circles, and in the popular imagination. The Lurianic scheme, read by its followers as harmonious with, and successively more advanced than the Cordoverian, mostly displaced it, becoming the foundation of subsequent developments in Jewish mysticism. After the Ari, the Zohar was interpreted in Lurianic terms, and later esoteric Kabbalists expanded mystical theory within the Lurianic system. The later Hasidic and Mitnagdic movements diverged over implications of Lurianic Kabbalah, and its social role in popular mysticism
Hasidism is the more mystical movement, Mitnag is more 'logical'.

So - now let me summarize -

Luria postulated that, in order to accomplish Creation, God had to 'contract godself' to make 'space' for the material world. This contraction is called 'tzimtzum'.

Then we have the FIRST creation --- I guarantee you won't understand this bit, because nobody really does unless the spend years immersed in Kabbalah -
The first Divine configuration within the vacuum comprises Adam Kadmon, the first pristine Spiritual Realm described in earlier Kabbalah. It is the manifestation of the specific Divine Will for subsequent Creation, within the relative framework of Creation. Its anthropomorphic name metaphorically indicates the paradox of creation ("Adam") and manifestation ("Kadmon"-Primordial Divinity). Man is intended as the future embodiment in subsequent Creation, not yet emerged, of the Divine manifestations. The Kav forms the sephirot, still only latent, of Adam Kadmon in two stages: first as Iggulim ("Circles"), then encompassed as Yosher ("Upright"), the two schemes of arranging the sephirot. In Luria's systematic explanation of terms found in classic Kabbalah:

Iggulim ("Circles") is the sephirot acting as 10 independent "concentric" principles
Yosher ("Upright") is a Partzuf (Configuration) where the sephirot act in harmony with each other in the three column scheme
There are many art works depicting the Sephirot, some are circular or rather, serpentine or like 'infinity', and others are in the form of either a tree, or a human being. I'll try to find some links to images.

Ok, the trouble was, the nascent creation couldn't contain the sacredness remnants of the presence of God, which left an impression in 'the world, and the vessels designed to hold the remnants shattered. The 'sparks' of sacredness are thus scattered throughout Creation, and are 'hidden'. Because of this shattering of the vessels, there is evil in the world.

Believe me, this is the REALLY short version.
This state, the World of Tohu ("Chaos") precipitated a cosmic catastrophe in the Divine realm. Tohu is characterised by high Divine Ohr (Light) in weak, immature, unharmonised vessels. As the Divine light poured into the first intellectual sephirot, their vessels were close enough to their source to contain the abundance of vitality. However, as the overflow continued, the subsequent emotional sephirot shattered (Shevirat HaKeilim - "Shattering of the Vessels") from Binah (Understanding) down to Yesod (Foundation) under the intensity of the light. The final sephirah Malkhut (Kingship) remains partially intact as the exiled Shekhina (Feminine Divine immanence) in Creation. This is the esoteric account in Genesis[10] and Chronicles[11] of the 8 Kings of Edom who reigned before any King reigned in Israel. The shards of the broken vessels fell down from the realm of Tohu into the subsequent created order of Tikun ("Rectification"), splintering into innumerable fragments, each animated by exiled Nitzutzot ("Sparks") of their original light. The more subtle Divine sparks became assimilated in higher spiritual realms as their creative lifeforce. The coarser animated fragments fell down into our material realm, with lower fragments nurturing the Kelipot (Shells) realms of impurity.
Got it? Our world is imperfect because of this initial shattering (see 'the Fall' in Christian theology).
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

The task of rectifying the sparks of holiness that were exiled in the self-aware lower spiritual Worlds was given to Biblical Adam in the Garden of Eden. In the Lurianic account, Adam and Hava (Eve) before the sin of Tree of Knowledge did not reside in the physical World Assiah ("Action"), at the present level of Malkhut (lowest sephirah "Kingship"). Instead, the Garden was the non-physical realm of Yetzirah ("Formation"), and at the higher sephirah of Tiferet ("Beauty").
Basically, there are Four Worlds. We live in 'Assiah', the world of Action.

I kind of skipped partzufim, mostly because I don't understand that much at all - but basically, the 10 sephirot - oh never mind. It gets very complicated at this point.
Luria's psychological system, upon which is based his devotional and meditational Kabbalah, is closely connected with his metaphysical doctrines. From the five partzufim, he says, emanated five souls, Nefesh ("Spirit"), Ru'ach ("Wind"), Neshamah ("Soul"), Chayah ("Life"), and Yechidah ("Singular"); the first of these being the lowest, and the last the highest. (Source: Etz Chayim). Man's soul is the connecting link between the infinite and the finite, and as such is of a manifold character. All the souls destined for the human race were created together with the various organs of Adam. As there are superior and inferior organs, so there are superior and inferior souls, according to the organs with which they are respectively coupled. Thus there are souls of the brain, souls of the eye, souls of the hand, etc. Each human soul is a spark (nitzotz) from Adam. The first sin of the first man caused confusion among the various classes of souls: the superior intermingled with the inferior; good with evil; so that even the purest soul received an admixture of evil, or, as Luria calls it, of the element of the "shells" (Kelipoth). In consequence of the confusion, the former are not wholly deprived of the original good, and the latter are not altogether free from sin. This state of confusion, which gives a continual impulse toward evil, will cease with the arrival of the Messiah, who will establish the moral system of the world upon a new basis.
Anyway - modern Judaism - even PRE-Modern Judaism - teaches as standard normal doctrine, that humans are born neutral, with more or less equal 'inclinations', one to do good, and the other to do evil. This is right out of Lurianic kabbalah.

Modern Judaism ALSO teaches as standard normal doctrine (and it is very popular especially in 'new age' type congregations) the Lurianic idea of 'tikun olam' or 'repairing the world'. Tikkun Olam is 'fixing/restoring the world' and by so doing, you are collecting and shining up those original lost sparks of divine light which are scattered in this world. Once all the divine sparks are revived and retrieved, the world will be perfect (and the messiah will come, the end of days, yada yada and so forth).

Doing Tikkun Olam can be as complicated as ending war or as simple as helping an old lady across the street, or lighting Shabbat candles, or donating to charity. Anything and everything you and I do to make the world a better place is, simultaneously, acting in the OTHER worlds to being about divine reunification of the original light of creation, which will make all the worlds whole.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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agricola
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Re: Ask about Judaism

Post by agricola »

Summing up -
Rabbi Luria's ideas enjoy wide recognition among Jews today. Orthodox as well as Reform, Reconstructionist and other Progressive Jews frequently acknowledge a moral obligation to "repair the world" (tikkun olam). This idea draws upon Luria's teaching that shards of divinity remain contained in flawed material creation and that ritual and ethical deeds by the righteous help to release this energy. The mystical theology of the Ari does not exercise the same level of influence everywhere, however. Communities where Luria's thought holds less sway include many German and Modern Orthodox communities, groups carrying forward Spanish and Portuguese traditions, a sizable segment of Baladi Yemenite Jews (see Dor Daim), and other groups that follow a form of Torah Judaism based more on classical authorities like Maimonides and the Geonim.

With its Rationalist project, the 19th century Haskalah movement and the critical study of Judaism dismissed Kabbalah. In the 20th century, Gershom Scholem initiated the academic study of Jewish mysticism, utilising historical methodology, but reacting against what he saw as its exclusively Rationalist dogma. Rather, he identified Jewish mysticism as the vital undercurrent of Jewish thought, periodically renewing Judaism with new mystical or messianic impetus. The 20th century academic respect of Kabbalah, as well as wider interest in spirituality, bolster a renewed Kabbalistic interest from non-Orthodox Jewish denominations in the 20th century. This is often expressed through the form of Hasidic incorporation of Kabbalah, embodied in Neo-Hasidism and Jewish Renewal.
Although I am mostly a major fan of Maimonides ('the Rambam'), I also have some influences from Hasidism, especially that of Nachman of Breslov. I find Lurianic kabballah more 'friendly' and logical than most other schemes, and one of the synagogues we belong to (we are members of two, plus our own locally based chavurah (friendship/community group) is Jewish Renewal.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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