Hmm - Pelagius - Original Sin isn't there - okay, that sounds like a CoC
HOWEVER apparently he ALSO thought you didn't need to get baptized to be saved - oops.
Arminius believed also (as did Pelagius) that people could be saved basically by doing everything right (i.e., 'be ye perfect').
As did - it seems - about half the known Christian heretics in history! Just do everything perfectly correctly!!!! It would have been more helpful if they had agreed on what 'correct' actually looked like.
What's amazing is how these iassorted 'heretical' ideas never seem to go away, but keep popping up over and over again.
Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
So THAT's what that was!! That was killer...truly...in the cofc.Arminius believed also (as did Pelagius) that people could be saved basically by doing everything right (i.e., 'be ye perfect').
Perfectionism and the cofc go hand in hand.
~Stone Cold Ivyrose Austin~
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
I remember one of mine and Moogy's "pastors" (hehe 
) doing a lot of teaching on those different "false" doctrines, and I really kind of wish I could recall now what they were. Calvinism I can pretty much recall, but not Arminianism, Pelagianism (Pelagius...who dat??? 
). I remember, vaguely, "TULIP", but not Amyraldism.
Tell me about Pelagianism. That sounds like the one. I can also google, of course.
My husband (adult convert, while we were dating...so he was motivated, lol) also says the cofcs we knew seemed a bit like the deists, with the distant being out there somewhere who is not really involved with humans, reason and intellect are about all we have, etc.
) doing a lot of teaching on those different "false" doctrines, and I really kind of wish I could recall now what they were. Calvinism I can pretty much recall, but not Arminianism, Pelagianism (Pelagius...who dat??? ). I remember, vaguely, "TULIP", but not Amyraldism. Tell me about Pelagianism. That sounds like the one. I can also google, of course.
My husband (adult convert, while we were dating...so he was motivated, lol) also says the cofcs we knew seemed a bit like the deists, with the distant being out there somewhere who is not really involved with humans, reason and intellect are about all we have, etc.
~Stone Cold Ivyrose Austin~
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
My tiny west Texas town has a primitive Baptist Church. It is so small that when I last heard, they only meet once a month. A visiting preacher comes to preach and lead singing. And they definitely have foot-washing, but I have seen that (at Maundy Thursday services) in Methodist churches.
This little town previously had two COCs, regular and no-class. Now they have only the regular, mainline group. There are two Assembly of God churches, English-speaking and Spanish-speaking. I am not sure how many Baptists we have, but there is a Southern Baptist church, a not-Southern Baptist Church (biggest Protestant church in town), a Spanish-speaking Baptist church, a Black Baptist Church, the Primitive Baptists, and possibly more. The Methodists, Presbyterian, and Catholics each have one church each.
This little town previously had two COCs, regular and no-class. Now they have only the regular, mainline group. There are two Assembly of God churches, English-speaking and Spanish-speaking. I am not sure how many Baptists we have, but there is a Southern Baptist church, a not-Southern Baptist Church (biggest Protestant church in town), a Spanish-speaking Baptist church, a Black Baptist Church, the Primitive Baptists, and possibly more. The Methodists, Presbyterian, and Catholics each have one church each.
Moogy
NI COC for over 30 years, but out for over 40 years now
Mostly Methodist for about 30 years.
Left the UMC in 2019 based on their decision to condemn LGBT+ persons and to discipline Pastors who perform same-sex marriages
NI COC for over 30 years, but out for over 40 years now
Mostly Methodist for about 30 years.
Left the UMC in 2019 based on their decision to condemn LGBT+ persons and to discipline Pastors who perform same-sex marriages
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
Forgive me for asking something that is sort of off the topic of the original post but, Is First Baptist an individual denomination unto its self? Every town that I know of has a First Baptist church among the other Baptist churches such as Missionary, and General.
"All things are difficult before they are easy."(found in a fortune cookie)
"We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the oppressed. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Forgetting isn't healing." Elie Wiesel
"We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the oppressed. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Forgetting isn't healing." Elie Wiesel
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
I believe most churches called 'First Baptist' are part of the Northern Baptists - the group the Southern Baptists split from back in 1845 over slavery.
Let me just check though -
h**s://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Baptist_Churches_USA
That group is now called 'American Baptist Churches USA' I think. They haven't kept the exact same name forever.
HOWEVER - after a far too lengthy deep dive into Baptists in America (good heavens there are a lot of them!) - the actual answer is that
'First Baptist' doesn't mean zilch.
It's just the first baptist church in that particular town, and what SORT of Baptists they are at First Baptist Church Insert City Name Here, depends on whatever Baptist denomination built the first Baptist church in town.
That does, however, bias them toward the OLDER Baptist bunches.
But every 'First Baptist' I personally know of (which - admittedly - isn't a whole lot) has been American Baptist (i.e., Northern, not Southern) and - for Baptists - kind of 'liberal-ish' in the political and social sense of the word.
Which doesn't actually necessarily describe the First Baptist Church Nearest You, wherever that happens to be.
Let me just check though -
h**s://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Baptist_Churches_USA
That group is now called 'American Baptist Churches USA' I think. They haven't kept the exact same name forever.
HOWEVER - after a far too lengthy deep dive into Baptists in America (good heavens there are a lot of them!) - the actual answer is that
'First Baptist' doesn't mean zilch.
It's just the first baptist church in that particular town, and what SORT of Baptists they are at First Baptist Church Insert City Name Here, depends on whatever Baptist denomination built the first Baptist church in town.
That does, however, bias them toward the OLDER Baptist bunches.
But every 'First Baptist' I personally know of (which - admittedly - isn't a whole lot) has been American Baptist (i.e., Northern, not Southern) and - for Baptists - kind of 'liberal-ish' in the political and social sense of the word.
Which doesn't actually necessarily describe the First Baptist Church Nearest You, wherever that happens to be.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
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longdistancerunner
- Posts: 193
- Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2022 11:56 pm
Re: Similarities/Differences in CoC and Primitive Baptists
Campbell was an ecumenical leader, I have not seen any Calvinist (predestination) tendencies in what I have read about him. Stone was more of a charismatic with practices more closely related to pentecostals. But like you I haven't read much about Stone recently.