Page 1 of 2
COC Propaganda
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:06 pm
by illuminator
This was forwarded to me in my email today. Notice the stress upon confession by mouth. If you're mute, you're screwed?
Baptism Refused
One Monday morning recently I received a call from my parents. They called to ask if I would go to Parkview Hospital and visit the family of their next-door neighbor’s sister. The woman’s husband entreated them to contact me so that I could baptize her.
When I arrived at the hospital, I found her husband at his wit’s end because of his grief and the intense fear he felt from knowing that his wife was not baptized. Upon entering the room and striving to communicate with the woman, I realized that although I ached for her distraught husband of 50+ years, there was no way I could baptize her. She was near comatose; she could not swallow or talk; she had not eaten for a week; her left shoulder was fractured from a fall a couple of weeks earlier. There was no way she could confess with her mouth unto salvation (Romans 10:10), nor was it very likely that the hospital staff would permit me to immerse her even if she could talk. Sadly, she had had at least 60 years of adult life and she had not prepared herself for this earth’s one inevitability: death. Her window of opportunity to obey the gospel had apparently been shut.
The temptation to compromise and seek to offer false hope was definitely felt. Intense anguish of the human soul is a horrific sight. According to church historians, the practice of sprinkling and pouring as “baptism” began in the third century under similar circumstances as this one. Somewhere earlier in the stream of time, someone failed to resist this enticing temptation. What a flood of false assurance and hope has come as a result.
The purpose of baptism, though, is not to please others or to reassure their conscience. It is immensely more intimate and personal than that; it is the answer of (an earnest seeking for) a good conscience toward God (1 Peter 3:21). Sadly, this woman was in such a state that she could not do this. To baptize her now would be as meaningless and as ineffective as “baptizing” an infant.
The time to face the reality of death and the Judgment is now, not later. “TODAY if you will hear His voice, do not harden your hearts” (Hebrews 4:7). If you have not earnestly sought a good conscience toward God by being baptized into Christ for the remission of your sins, do not let today’s window of opportunity close on you. “Behold NOW is the accepted time; behold NOW is the day of salvation” (2 Corinthians 6:2).
Jeff Chowning
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:17 pm
by sonicrainkrieg42
And they wonder why people turn away.
You can't baptize infants, you apparently can't baptize the mute, but you can baptize ten year old kids. Because if anyone understands religion deep enough to make a commitment to it, it's ten year old children.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:29 pm
by KLP
I agree she could not be baptized due to physical circumstances. But I find it hard to believe that lack of physical water baptism is going to be her problem if she had a will and desire. The confess verbally and audibly with the mouth thing is also whack as being the knock out factor. If she was sincere and wanting to be pleasing then that is whittling on God's end of the stick to decide where she ends up. But it is the same with telling your loved ones (and pets) that you love them...you need to do it today and frequently because who knows what might happen. Time runs out for everyone and for everything...it is the sad but absolute reality of this life.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:30 pm
by AtPeace
Wow, just reading that nauseates me.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 7:37 pm
by illuminator
I think we've discussed in other treads about where one's heart is and whether or not there's water involved, but like AtPeace said, it really nauseates me reading this. But that's the coc scare tactics for you! I think that's why the coc has so many re-baptisms. There's no peace, only constant fear.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:26 am
by ena
illuminator wrote:I think we've discussed in other treads about where one's heart is and whether or not there's water involved, but like AtPeace said, it really nauseates me reading this. But that's the coc scare tactics for you! I think that's why the coc has so many re-baptisms. There's no peace, only constant fear.
It is nauseating. I wonder what my parents saw in this group. The lack of peace and surety is not from God. I do not limit God or speak for God as that would be offensive. KJV Matt 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Matt 25:40 (KJV)
Note the concern. I suggest the whole chapter. While a dunking cleans the flesh what happens spiritually is done by God and beyond the physical. Much in Christianity is symbolic because humans are limited beings. Some have much trouble with that. God is not limited by man or the CoC. They assume too much. How much good news did you hear? The view has no balance.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2015 8:59 am
by illuminator
Very good post ena. Really sums it up.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:49 am
by Aces
I am new here so forgive me if I speak out of turn.
I am sorry that you are still getting mail from the coc.
Next, I am saddened that anyone thinks they can choose someone else's spiritual path. I have heard many times about how people on their death beds are being pressed upon to become christian. It happened to Edgar Alan Poe. It happened to my father-in-law on his. It would have happened to me a few years ago, when I was very ill, if my wife had not stopped them.
Be prepared.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:30 pm
by Moogy
In my job as a medical social worker, I help people with theiradvance directives. There is a section for extra instructions. I never knew what someone might list there. If your relatives are likely to impose their religion on you when you are defenseless, I think a restriction could be listed, even though technically those are not medical requests. But "don't let a COC preacher pray over me" sounds like a reasonable restriction.
Re: COC Propaganda
Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 11:06 am
by Struggler
When one of my neighbors was terminally ill, his brother was mean and useless and only after his money and stuff. So we friends became his family and made sure he had what he needed and wanted, including his final wish to die at home.
He was a good Christian who lived it. When one of my C of C co-workers found out I was helping, he asked if I had discussed spiritual matters with my neighbor. When I said I had, he asked what church my neighbor attended. When I said Methodist, my co-worker said "they don't care about salvation" and told me I needed to get someone from "the church" over there as soon as possible. Of course, I did not do that. And a C of C minister friend told me my co-worker was out of line to suggest such.