I saw an online article refuting the allegation the church of Christ is a cult. Some things rubbed me the wrong way, and I wanted to share them. Condensed from an article link below. My responses are brief but open for longer discussions.
The church of Christ has no single human leader.
While this is true, think of it more as a collective mindset, like the Borg.
The church of Christ is not isolationist.
The idea of the church of Christ as the one true church disproves this statement.
The church of Christ does not practice dishonest or manipulative preaching techniques.
Oh, but it does. The church of Christ is a master at guilt and shame preaching, and the manipulations of mind control.
The church of Christ does not control its members’ finances.
I recall several guilt and shame sermons focusing on the Old Testament tithing. If you’re not giving 10% YOU’RE SINNING. And what is done with that money? Help orphans? No. Help those in need? No. Build God a kitchen or a gymnasium? Yes. Send the preacher’s and elders’ families on glorified paid vacations and call them “mission trips”? Yes.
The church of Christ does not control every area of its members’ lives.
Oh, but it does! Ever miss a service?
The church of Christ does not create bizarre doctrines without evidence and then force members to believe them.
Try the “five acts of worship”.
The church of Christ does not harass, threaten, or stalk members who leave.
Last week the preacher at the congregation I used to attend verbally attacked me at the supermarket calling me – in a very loud voice – an unrepentant sinner and that God doesn’t hear my prayers. That, I guess this wasn't harassment.
The church of Christ does not take all of its members’ time and prevent them from doing anything else.
Try doing something outside the church. Try taking a family vacation. Be sure to check with the elders to find solid congregations where you can stop and worship, and if you can’t find one, be sure to pack a juice box and crackers so you can stop on the side of the church and play church.
Finally, the church of Christ does not use negative, psychological manipulation and mind ¬control to intimidate its members.
Bullshit.
Link: http://www.truthmagazine.com/archives/v ... 012008.htm
Refuting the Refutations
Re: Refuting the Refutations
The topic of 'is the coc a cult?' has come up here before. Our usual and consistent opinion as a group has been 'no, not a cult, but it is certainly cult-ISH'.
Like a lot of things, the coc is lukewarm on culting, being neither an honest cult nor a proper normal religious organization (which all - or almost all - have some of the characteristics you just brought up - the coc is not unique in claiming to have the truth, nor in asking members to commit time and money, nor in using persuasive - even strongly pervasive - teachings. It just doesn't give much in RETURN for all that, which many other denominations provide in the form of comfort, aid, validation...
Like a lot of things, the coc is lukewarm on culting, being neither an honest cult nor a proper normal religious organization (which all - or almost all - have some of the characteristics you just brought up - the coc is not unique in claiming to have the truth, nor in asking members to commit time and money, nor in using persuasive - even strongly pervasive - teachings. It just doesn't give much in RETURN for all that, which many other denominations provide in the form of comfort, aid, validation...
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
-
sonicrainkrieg42
- Posts: 61
- Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:28 pm
Re: Refuting the Refutations
I agree on the "not a cult, but cult-ish" point.
A thing about the isolationism: while the CoC does not promote physical isolation, as in moving all of the "faithful" to a compound where they are never to leave, they do promote a sort of mental isolation by saying that anything not church approved is of "the world", and that we should be "apart from the world".
It's not difficult to see how an actual cult, the Boston movement, grew out of it. There is a part of me that suspects that another cult could rise from the CoC again, due to members being frightened of the dropping numbers of young adults, but I don't think it's very likely. They'll probably just continue their current state of shocked disbelief that anyone could find fault with their theology.
A thing about the isolationism: while the CoC does not promote physical isolation, as in moving all of the "faithful" to a compound where they are never to leave, they do promote a sort of mental isolation by saying that anything not church approved is of "the world", and that we should be "apart from the world".
It's not difficult to see how an actual cult, the Boston movement, grew out of it. There is a part of me that suspects that another cult could rise from the CoC again, due to members being frightened of the dropping numbers of young adults, but I don't think it's very likely. They'll probably just continue their current state of shocked disbelief that anyone could find fault with their theology.
Closeted ex coc, trans woman, and secular humanist
Re: Refuting the Refutations
I do agree about the cult-ish. I did feel like I had been brainwashed when I left.
Re: Refuting the Refutations
Interesting. I sure had a lot of guilt to deal with. Try being a free human.
-
GuitarHero
- Posts: 253
- Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:13 am
Re: Refuting the Refutations
I seem to recall reading this a few years back. At least whoever posted it this time was smart enough to omit having a comment section. I tore the article completely to shreds and point-by-point refuted it. And I mean I completely demolished it. There was no way around it.
Of course, it was all for naught. Basically the person just covered their ears and shouted "IS NOT!" until they believed it again.
Of course, it was all for naught. Basically the person just covered their ears and shouted "IS NOT!" until they believed it again.
Re: Refuting the Refutations
Ha! In true coc form, most of their bold statements in the article are false, with the exception of the fist one you mentioned.
-
GuitarHero
- Posts: 253
- Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:13 am
Re: Refuting the Refutations
Found it. This was my response:
The CofC does not fit the traditional world-view of a "cult." (I.E. Branch Davidians, Raelians, Jim Jones, etc.)
But let's look at the definition of a cult, given the 13 characters listed by the American Family Foundation:
1. The group is focused on a living leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment. -- While the CofC would proclaim its leadership as solely in the hands of Jesus Christ, the truth is that a lot of CofCers are focused on "cults of personality," i.e. very charismatic preachers. There is unquestioning dedication to following the words of "elders," and the word of the elder is to be treated equally with the word of God. (I've been told that if an elder says it, it's the same as if God was saying it!)
2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members. -- Will any CofCer deny this?
3. The group is preoccupied with making money. -- One of the big 5 acts of worship in the CofC is giving. It is considered essential to worship, and is commanded to be done every Sunday. Failure to do so makes one an "unfaithful member." Churches take up collection with or without any real or pressing need, even if they have hundreds of thousands of dollars already socked away in the bank.
4. Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished. -- This is undoubtedly true of the CofC. If one offers an opposing view on baptism, miracles, instrumental music, etc. they are taken aside and admonished, if not outright banned from participation in teaching classes, leading prayers, communion serving, etc. Leadership does not tolerate deviation from the party line. First instances are usually countered by hushing the person up, and having the preacher or elder admonish them in private. Continued instances are almost always met by disfellowship, after which a person cannot be allowed to partake in communion, speak in services, lead a prayer, and in some congregations, members are not even allowed to eat or speak with this person.
5. Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, denunciation sessions, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group and its leader(s). -- The CofC practices this by constantly repeating their dogma. There are continual repetitions of their unwritten creeds. Ideas like "instrumental music in worship is sinful" are repeated ad nauseum, even though the entire congregation may have already agreed upon it. Issues such as marriage, divorce, and remarriage are constantly harped on. There are often entire months devoted to why all the other denominations are wrong. The idea of grace is downplayed. Whenever problems arise, there are almost always series of lessons and Bible classes devoted to that exact problem, often calling down the person in question, though perhaps not by name, from the pulpit.
6. The leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel (for example: members must get permission from leaders to date, change jobs, get married; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so forth). -- This is more true in the ICOC and Boston movement branches than in the mainline CofC, but it definitely exists in the mainline CofC to a degree, and perhaps there is even more severity in the CofC offshoots called "anti" or "non-institutional." The CofC continually preaches that it is wrong to marry anyone outside of the CofC, and only concedes a little that if you do so, you must constantly be trying to convert them. Attitudes toward marriage are very strictly enforced. And you can forget about getting re-married after a divorce. Most CofC's teach that if anyone is re-married or in an "unscriptural marriage," they must divorce their current spouse in order to be pleasing to God and be fully redeemed. CofC's have been known to strongly discourage jobs that conflict with worship times, and have at times shamed members into seeking alternate employment that will fit their church's schedule. The CofC certainly dictates the attire of their members--no shorts, you're not allowed to serve during worship wearing casual clothing. Ladies' hemlines are a VERY popular topic in CofC preaching and literature. CofC is very vocal in its prescription of how to raise and discipline a child. Corporal punishment is very much championed by the CofC. Bible classes toward children are geared toward brainwashing them from a very young age. They are discouraged to question church authority and inundated with specific church dogmas, such as instrumental music, etc.
7. The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity). -- Need I really say more? The CofC has a reputation the world over of believing they will be the only ones residing in Heaven post-Judgement Day. This is nothing new. And CofCs believe it too. One needs to read very little of their literature to understand that. The leader is not considered Messiah, but he does speak the words of the Messiah, and commands a great deal of respect and often garners ardent followers. And of course, the CofC has a special mission to save humanity. They take, at least they say they do, "Go ye into all the world" quite literally. They believe that they, and they alone, have the complete truth of salvation, and that it is their responsibility to recruit as many people as possible so that they will be saved..
8. The group has a polarized us-versus-them mentality, which causes conflict with the wider society. -- CofC fits this very perfectly. CofC versus Baptists. CofC versus Catholics. CofC versus Methodists. CofC versus the WORLD.
9. The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities (as are, for example, military commanders and ministers, priests, monks, and rabbis of mainstream denominations). -- Many CofC preachers are not accountable to anyone, especially in congregations without elderships. And even in those congregations, no one can hold the elders accountable. There has been a big issue in the CofC recently regarding the congregation's reaffirming of elders. There is a loud voice screaming that it is unscriptural to do so, and that the congregation has no authority to question whether or not an elder is fit for the job.
10. The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means that members would have considered unethical before joining the group (for example: collecting money for bogus charities). -- CofCers have absolutely no boundaries when it comes to saving the souls of their loved ones. They will harass them with letters or visits, bombard them with phone calls, show up at their places of work. They will gossip about and snoop around for information on so-called erring brothers. Family members will violate each others' privacy. The list could truly go on and on. In fact, in many ex-CofC groups, there are whole sub-forums dedicated to the discussion of various spiritual abuses and atrocities that many ex-members have had to endure.
11. The leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to control them. -- Again, need I really say more? Every Sunday, there is an invitation for sinning members to "come forward" and confess to sins. Most ex-CofCers refer to this as the "Walk of Shame." Members are encouraged to make a spectacle of themselves and publicly repent of their sins. Some congregations require this when members are caught in a sin by someone in the congregation. Aside from this, many preachers are not shy about discussing specific congregants (sometimes by name, sometimes in vague but recognizable terms) from the pulpit when said congregant is "in rebellion" to church doctrine. Often, entire sermons are meant to shame a certain behavior, whether it is known to exist in the congregation or not. Members are often shamed for doing things such as taking medication for depression and criticized as lacking in faith.
12. Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with family and friends, and to give up personal goals and activities that were of interest before joining the group. -- Ask any former CofC member that has been "disfellowshipped" how they have been treated by family members who are still loyal to the CofC after the fact. This qualification is very firmly entrenched in CofC culture.
13. Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group. -- Gotta be there twice on Sunday, once on Wednesday, and every single time there is a Gospel Meeting, VBS, or any other church activity. Lack of attendance to any of these = "unfaithful." School, homework, sports, or any other conflicts are expected to be completely ignored when it conflicts with church times, as are job duties and family commitments. The church is supreme above all, and must be attended whenever the doors are opened. There is absolutely no consideration of changing service times to fit the needs of members. Members are to fit their lives around the church.
14. Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members. -- Do not date "non-Christians." Your friends should be church members! Support member-run businesses! Don't eat or speak with those who have been "disfellowshipped." You should only live in a community with a "faithful, sound church." Your relationship to Christians is more important and pressing than a relationship with family or non-CofC friends. Even if a family member is making a rare visit from far away, church members are expected to attend services. They are encouraged to bring the family members if they are willing, but if not, the family member should be left at home while the church member attends the services.
The CofC does not fit the traditional world-view of a "cult." (I.E. Branch Davidians, Raelians, Jim Jones, etc.)
But let's look at the definition of a cult, given the 13 characters listed by the American Family Foundation:
1. The group is focused on a living leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment. -- While the CofC would proclaim its leadership as solely in the hands of Jesus Christ, the truth is that a lot of CofCers are focused on "cults of personality," i.e. very charismatic preachers. There is unquestioning dedication to following the words of "elders," and the word of the elder is to be treated equally with the word of God. (I've been told that if an elder says it, it's the same as if God was saying it!)
2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members. -- Will any CofCer deny this?
3. The group is preoccupied with making money. -- One of the big 5 acts of worship in the CofC is giving. It is considered essential to worship, and is commanded to be done every Sunday. Failure to do so makes one an "unfaithful member." Churches take up collection with or without any real or pressing need, even if they have hundreds of thousands of dollars already socked away in the bank.
4. Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished. -- This is undoubtedly true of the CofC. If one offers an opposing view on baptism, miracles, instrumental music, etc. they are taken aside and admonished, if not outright banned from participation in teaching classes, leading prayers, communion serving, etc. Leadership does not tolerate deviation from the party line. First instances are usually countered by hushing the person up, and having the preacher or elder admonish them in private. Continued instances are almost always met by disfellowship, after which a person cannot be allowed to partake in communion, speak in services, lead a prayer, and in some congregations, members are not even allowed to eat or speak with this person.
5. Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, denunciation sessions, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group and its leader(s). -- The CofC practices this by constantly repeating their dogma. There are continual repetitions of their unwritten creeds. Ideas like "instrumental music in worship is sinful" are repeated ad nauseum, even though the entire congregation may have already agreed upon it. Issues such as marriage, divorce, and remarriage are constantly harped on. There are often entire months devoted to why all the other denominations are wrong. The idea of grace is downplayed. Whenever problems arise, there are almost always series of lessons and Bible classes devoted to that exact problem, often calling down the person in question, though perhaps not by name, from the pulpit.
6. The leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel (for example: members must get permission from leaders to date, change jobs, get married; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so forth). -- This is more true in the ICOC and Boston movement branches than in the mainline CofC, but it definitely exists in the mainline CofC to a degree, and perhaps there is even more severity in the CofC offshoots called "anti" or "non-institutional." The CofC continually preaches that it is wrong to marry anyone outside of the CofC, and only concedes a little that if you do so, you must constantly be trying to convert them. Attitudes toward marriage are very strictly enforced. And you can forget about getting re-married after a divorce. Most CofC's teach that if anyone is re-married or in an "unscriptural marriage," they must divorce their current spouse in order to be pleasing to God and be fully redeemed. CofC's have been known to strongly discourage jobs that conflict with worship times, and have at times shamed members into seeking alternate employment that will fit their church's schedule. The CofC certainly dictates the attire of their members--no shorts, you're not allowed to serve during worship wearing casual clothing. Ladies' hemlines are a VERY popular topic in CofC preaching and literature. CofC is very vocal in its prescription of how to raise and discipline a child. Corporal punishment is very much championed by the CofC. Bible classes toward children are geared toward brainwashing them from a very young age. They are discouraged to question church authority and inundated with specific church dogmas, such as instrumental music, etc.
7. The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity). -- Need I really say more? The CofC has a reputation the world over of believing they will be the only ones residing in Heaven post-Judgement Day. This is nothing new. And CofCs believe it too. One needs to read very little of their literature to understand that. The leader is not considered Messiah, but he does speak the words of the Messiah, and commands a great deal of respect and often garners ardent followers. And of course, the CofC has a special mission to save humanity. They take, at least they say they do, "Go ye into all the world" quite literally. They believe that they, and they alone, have the complete truth of salvation, and that it is their responsibility to recruit as many people as possible so that they will be saved..
8. The group has a polarized us-versus-them mentality, which causes conflict with the wider society. -- CofC fits this very perfectly. CofC versus Baptists. CofC versus Catholics. CofC versus Methodists. CofC versus the WORLD.
9. The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities (as are, for example, military commanders and ministers, priests, monks, and rabbis of mainstream denominations). -- Many CofC preachers are not accountable to anyone, especially in congregations without elderships. And even in those congregations, no one can hold the elders accountable. There has been a big issue in the CofC recently regarding the congregation's reaffirming of elders. There is a loud voice screaming that it is unscriptural to do so, and that the congregation has no authority to question whether or not an elder is fit for the job.
10. The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means that members would have considered unethical before joining the group (for example: collecting money for bogus charities). -- CofCers have absolutely no boundaries when it comes to saving the souls of their loved ones. They will harass them with letters or visits, bombard them with phone calls, show up at their places of work. They will gossip about and snoop around for information on so-called erring brothers. Family members will violate each others' privacy. The list could truly go on and on. In fact, in many ex-CofC groups, there are whole sub-forums dedicated to the discussion of various spiritual abuses and atrocities that many ex-members have had to endure.
11. The leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to control them. -- Again, need I really say more? Every Sunday, there is an invitation for sinning members to "come forward" and confess to sins. Most ex-CofCers refer to this as the "Walk of Shame." Members are encouraged to make a spectacle of themselves and publicly repent of their sins. Some congregations require this when members are caught in a sin by someone in the congregation. Aside from this, many preachers are not shy about discussing specific congregants (sometimes by name, sometimes in vague but recognizable terms) from the pulpit when said congregant is "in rebellion" to church doctrine. Often, entire sermons are meant to shame a certain behavior, whether it is known to exist in the congregation or not. Members are often shamed for doing things such as taking medication for depression and criticized as lacking in faith.
12. Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with family and friends, and to give up personal goals and activities that were of interest before joining the group. -- Ask any former CofC member that has been "disfellowshipped" how they have been treated by family members who are still loyal to the CofC after the fact. This qualification is very firmly entrenched in CofC culture.
13. Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group. -- Gotta be there twice on Sunday, once on Wednesday, and every single time there is a Gospel Meeting, VBS, or any other church activity. Lack of attendance to any of these = "unfaithful." School, homework, sports, or any other conflicts are expected to be completely ignored when it conflicts with church times, as are job duties and family commitments. The church is supreme above all, and must be attended whenever the doors are opened. There is absolutely no consideration of changing service times to fit the needs of members. Members are to fit their lives around the church.
14. Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members. -- Do not date "non-Christians." Your friends should be church members! Support member-run businesses! Don't eat or speak with those who have been "disfellowshipped." You should only live in a community with a "faithful, sound church." Your relationship to Christians is more important and pressing than a relationship with family or non-CofC friends. Even if a family member is making a rare visit from far away, church members are expected to attend services. They are encouraged to bring the family members if they are willing, but if not, the family member should be left at home while the church member attends the services.
Re: Refuting the Refutations
Really - you know - a lot of that, if not most, is plain 'Christianity' altogether -
let the dead bury the dead
follow me
hate your mother and father and follow me
be not unequally yoked
they held everything in common
Annanias and Saphira....
I could go on, but - really.
let the dead bury the dead
follow me
hate your mother and father and follow me
be not unequally yoked
they held everything in common
Annanias and Saphira....
I could go on, but - really.
History is the fiction we invent to persuade ourselves that events are knowable and that life has order and direction. That's why events are always reinterpreted when values change. We need new versions of history to allow for our current prejudices.
-
GuitarHero
- Posts: 253
- Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:13 am
Re: Refuting the Refutations
You are absolutely correct.agricola wrote:Really - you know - a lot of that, if not most, is plain 'Christianity' altogether -
let the dead bury the dead
follow me
hate your mother and father and follow me
be not unequally yoked
they held everything in common
Annanias and Saphira....
I could go on, but - really.