If you could change the coC...

[bnot]

klp is right on. Change is not possible. What are the odds that a cofC to have a choir.... IM...... women song leader... women waiting on the table..let alone to have a elder admit that he drinks or has family issues. It can only be a cofC if you follow Paul's letters to a T. And then the cofC picks and chooses what rules it wants to take literally. Paul didn't tell Timothy to take wine for his stomach sake... it was grape juice... Women should not have short hair ( not sure how long?) and it is a disgrace for men to have long hair (not sure how long). Make melody in your heart... and God hates pianos and organ music... the cofC is not a denomination....we are the only ones that are going to heaven....

The list goes on. If you change the rules you are no longer a cofC http://cconline.faithsite.com/content.asp?CID=51223

This is on the front door of my old cofC. Do you really think that they will change?t

Established in ad33 is such a fraudulent statement. Utterly ridiculous.

[Phil]

Those who are in the driver seat in the coC see no reason for change. It's those in the flock who are followers and indoctrinated into something that is not truth (to them) who need to initiate change, or leave. Better off leaving because change isn't gonna happen with the current leadership.

It's all about personality type and your inner wiring. Those who buy into the coC doctrine are generally technical people and rigid thinkers, very grounded in scriptural correctness. They approach Christianity like it's a project to be performed and completed per biblical instructions, as if that all Christianity is about. They cannot see the spiritual truth because they are totally into scriptural correctness. Their objective is to do scriptural things without realizing that the NT never states that our objective to to be "scriptural." The word does not exist in the Bible. The actual Christian objective is to become "Spiritual," not "scriptural." The coC states that the Spirit speaks only through the scriptures even though the bible never says such. The NT states that God will work directly in the believer when the seeker has awakened to the Spirits presence within them. The coC can't afford to have Spirit work directly in the believer because then there would be no need for hierarchy in their system. They need co-dependency in their system to keep it together. That's also true in most other religions, but not to the extent it is in the coC.

Rigid thinking coC'ers do not know how to deal with anything abstract. The Spiritual realm is abstract, by definition. The Truth is not limited to logical conclusions, yet the coC wants to force it to be logical. They want to fit a square object into a round hole, and will insist that it will fit as long as they keep forcing it.

They are not going to change. But they are going to get smaller and smaller as more people get free of them and encourage others to do as they have done. The rigid thinkers will always be there, but the free thinkers need to get outta there and get on with what they were intended to do, and that is to live in the freedom of grace, something the coC will never understand.

[ena]

I don't hope to change the CoC. I see it's system of theology as corrupted by human meddling. To say that I hate their theology is not far from the point. I would rather rot in Hell than to return to that Hell on earth. I literally reached that point. It took a long time for me to realize that lies mixed with truth are very hard for a child to detect. Sorting out their crap is like mucking out a septic tank with a tea spoon, It takes that long. In the words of the Jamaican shrunken head on Harry Potter 2: Hold on It's going to be a bumpy ride.

[musicman]

klp is right on. Change is not possible. What are the odds that a cofC to have a choir.... IM...... women song leader... women waiting on the table..let alone to have a elder admit that he drinks or has family issues. It can only be a cofC if you follow Paul's letters to a T. And then the cofC picks and chooses what rules it wants to take literally. Paul didn't tell Timothy to take wine for his stomach sake... it was grape juice... Women should not have short hair ( not sure how long?) and it is a disgrace for men to have long hair (not sure how long). Make melody in your heart... and God hates pianos and organ music... the cofC is not a denomination....we are the only ones that are going to heaven....

The list goes on. If you change the rules you are no longer a cofC http://cconline.faithsite.com/content.asp?CID=51223

This is on the front door of my old cofC. Do you really think that they will change?t

Established in ad33 is such a fraudulent statement. Utterly ridiculous.

As for that A.D. 33 sign...doesn't C o C teach that lying is a sin?

[musicman]

Those who are in the driver seat in the coC see no reason for change. It's those in the flock who are followers and indoctrinated into something that is not truth (to them) who need to initiate change, or leave. Better off leaving because change isn't gonna happen with the current leadership.

It's all about personality type and your inner wiring. Those who buy into the coC doctrine are generally technical people and rigid thinkers, very grounded in scriptural correctness. They approach Christianity like it's a project to be performed and completed per biblical instructions, as if that all Christianity is about. They cannot see the spiritual truth because they are totally into scriptural correctness. Their objective is to do scriptural things without realizing that the NT never states that our objective to to be "scriptural." The word does not exist in the Bible. The actual Christian objective is to become "Spiritual," not "scriptural." The coC states that the Spirit speaks only through the scriptures even though the bible never says such. The NT states that God will work directly in the believer when the seeker has awakened to the Spirits presence within them. The coC can't afford to have Spirit work directly in the believer because then there would be no need for hierarchy in their system. They need co-dependency in their system to keep it together. That's also true in most other religions, but not to the extent it is in the coC.

Rigid thinking coC'ers do not know how to deal with anything abstract. The Spiritual realm is abstract, by definition. The Truth is not limited to logical conclusions, yet the coC wants to force it to be logical. They want to fit a square object into a round hole, and will insist that it will fit as long as they keep forcing it.

They are not going to change. But they are going to get smaller and smaller as more people get free of them and encourage others to do as they have done. The rigid thinkers will always be there, but the free thinkers need to get outta there and get on with what they were intended to do, and that is to live in the freedom of grace, something the coC will never understand.

C o C uses the Bible as a weapon against those who don't agree with its teachings. It has decided what it wants to believe, then assembled an arsenal of "proof texts" to back up those doctrines. These "proof texts" (usually taken completely out of conxtext) are then put into lists of rules which all must obey.

[B.H.]

Who is the member who keeps wanting respondents to **** off? What is your real issue that you can't be more to the point than the use of such ugly and unnessary retorts, and dear whomever you are, I am not interested in "baiting anyone", I am hear to listen and learn where I can eventually chart my own destiny. Not to cast barbs.

Love,

You are looking at what is called a signature. That is not anything I normally would say to anyone but it is something someone sent me in a private message on this board. It reminds me to have pity and also serves as a rebuke to the 60'ish year old man going 6'ish who sent it..

[agricola]

If you want to add a signature to your posts (a quote that always shows up) you can go to your profile (user control panel) and add anything you like. On this board I'm currently using the 'as an adolescent' quote because I'm a scientist and I think it's funny.

[ena]

ENA, So, are you saying if you could change anything about coC it would be it's dogma on MDR?

I think it is very judgmental with no consideration for many issues. The problem with using the Bible in everything is that you cannot ask the author for specifics as to what was really meant and to what extreme. The world is full of grays. Very few issues are black and white. Take instrumental music. The Jews do not eliminate it. Read Psalms 150. Does the new Testament say anything that would indicate one way or the other? Revelation 5 talks about elders with harps in heaven. The Grace Liner has just left the docks and the CoC is on the docks looking for a way across the water. I someone wants to sign acapella fine by me. Just don't claim the other is sinful. The main problem with the CoC is that people sin all the time and God does not expect perfection only a pure heart. They are in for a big surprise. You cannot see a pure heart. God can!

[Lev]

I someone wants to sign acapella fine by me. Just don't claim the other is sinful.

Exactly. That's the form for my answer to the OP question:

If someone wants to ___________, fine by me. Just don't claim the other is sinful.

Most of the specific things the COC does and believes are OK. So are the alternatives. It's that second part that gets lost in the doctrine.

Lev

[ena]

I someone wants to sign acapella fine by me. Just don't claim the other is sinful.

Sorry about the bad spelling. I think you got it. Should have read: If someone wants to sing acapella fine by me. I am working on a hard to read screen. I don't see instruments as a valid issue at all. The CoC works hard at making non sins into sins. Examples are instrumental music, Lord's supper once a week at least and forsaking. They choose the extreme rather than something reasonable. Even the Catholic gives indulgences to this day for people that cannot attend because their services are needed. Nun's acting as nurses that cannot attend for instance are granted an indulgence. They do not sell them however which was the objection of Luther. Never got one in the Coc.