Independent Christian churches

[NeverAgain]

Talk about a predictable saw, KLP, you have got it down pat. Sorry, but I will never concede that discriminatory and demeaning attitudes and legal inequality toward gays are "honest" differences in opinion meriting respectful attention and moral or intellectual equivalence. I suppose there was a time when pious and self-righteous bigots (if the shoe fits...) claimed an "honest difference of opinion" about interracial marriage, open housing, serving blacks in restaurants, women holding property or the humanness of Jews.

I have not used the term "homophobic" on this thread. I don"t think you fear gays. You just seem to despise them.

The "biblical" pattern for marriage? Well, that's debatable. See David, "a man after God's own heart." I have seen the usual pattern of picking and choosing verses and making them mean what you want them to mean on this subject. What unenlightened writers of millennia ago said means nothing to me anyway. Basic decency and a respect for human dignity should tell anyone that gay people are not "abominations" worthy if stoning, legal sanctions of an eternity in a burning hell, just because of who they love.

You and I know damn well what GuitarHero heard in what he described as a "homophobic" sermon. Fire ad brimstone and hiding behind scripture to rationalize bigotry and meanness.

Spare us your aggrieved victimhood. Discrimination against gays is wrong on a level that racism and sexism is wrong. Period.

[KLP]

Talk about a predictable saw, KLP, you have got it down pat. Sorry, but I will never concede that discriminatory and demeaning attitudes and legal inequality toward gays are "honest" differences in opinion meriting respectful attention and moral or intellectual equivalence. I suppose there was a time when pious and self-righteous bigots (if the shoe fits...) claimed an "honest difference of opinion" about interracial marriage, open housing, serving blacks in restaurants, women holding property or the humanness of Jews.

I have not used the term "homophobic" on this thread. I don"t think you fear gays. You just seem to despise them.

The "biblical" pattern for marriage? Well, that's debatable. See David, "a man after God's own heart." I have seen the usual pattern of picking and choosing verses and making them mean what you want them to mean on this subject. What unenlightened writers of millennia ago said means nothing to me anyway. Basic decency and a respect for human dignity should tell anyone that gay people are not "abominations" worthy if stoning, legal sanctions of an eternity in a burning hell, just because of who they love.

You and I know damn well what GuitarHero heard in what he described as a "homophobic" sermon. Fire ad brimstone and hiding behind scripture to rationalize bigotry and meanness.

Spare us your aggrieved victimhood. Discrimination against gays is wrong on a level that racism and sexism is wrong. Period.

Here is what I said

My argument is not that bigotry and racism are not unacceptable. The argument (if you will take time to listen) is that just because one accepts the Bible or millennia old definitions of marriage and family does not make that person a hater. There has to be room for actual and true diversity of opinion and acceptance of all.

That marriage and family have been overwhelming understood for 1000's of years as essentially a heterosexual relationship is an obvious fact that has nothing to do with the Bible, it is simply reality. All your comments about stoning and hell and unenlightened writers are just smoke and distraction. Please don't assume you can speak for me or know what I am thinking beyond what I have written. Your personal comments about me are offensive and out of line. If I despise anything it is vitriol and emotion and name-calling in place of logical and honest dialogue, maybe that is what you are picking up on.

[agricola]

OK separate corners. Everybody move along, nothing to see here.

[Fellow Traveler]

I hear enough of arguing over this topic in the news without having it hijack my thread. I thought this was supposed to be a place for healing but maybe not. Thanks.

[GuitarHero]

I hear enough of arguing over this topic in the news without having it hijack my thread. I thought this was supposed to be a place for healing but maybe not. Thanks.

It was certainly not my intention to get the thread de-railed. I suppose I should've known the usual suspect wouldn't be able to leave it alone.

Please don't think that you can't find healing here. I did. I hope you'll stick around and let us get to know you better.

[B.H.]

hijack

Sssshhhhhh. That's a very naughty word!

[KLP]

Maybe it has to do with the definition of healing and dialogue. I posted genuine and sincere arguments and supported them calmly. I do not resort to ridicule, name calling, belittling, and out right laughing at members. Perhaps I just have a different definition of what passes as "healing" and "respect". I would be glad to hear any actual discussion of something I said that was disrespectful, out of line, or incorrect. I am sorry that a call for diversity and acceptance of all is offensive, but I think it is important. And I think it is ultimately healing.

[agricola]

What are you guys, twelve?

People are actually allowed to have radically different opinions about all sorts of things. Really.

I'm deleting everything with a four letter word beginning with f and ending with k, because I want to, and posts involving nothing more than spite and ass holeishness.
So there. Now I'm twelve.

This is a 'dialog' forum, not a diss-fest.

[B.H.]

What are you guys, twelve?

People are actually allowed to have radically different opinions about all sorts of things. Really.

I'm deleting everything with a four letter word beginning with f and ending with k, because I want to, and posts involving nothing more than spite and ass holeishness.
So there. Now I'm twelve.

This is a 'dialog' forum, not a diss-fest.

Agricola is mad!

[GuitarHero]

It can't possibly be too much to ask to respect the OP's request to stop fouling up and hijacking his thread. Maybe create a new one, if you really must, but let's give this guy back his thread.